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SlvrScoobie
05-12-2008, 11:01 PM
24 TSE is here!
I met a guy on FM today and made the exchange. its like new, in box. Simply like it just came from Canon
Now to play with it!
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2292/2488628714_abac2a97c4.jpg?v=0
:banana:

Question for you TSE users though...
How does the AE work with shifts / tilts?
I noticed in my limited playing that shifting it vertically down freaks out the AE meter, and tends to Overexpose severely. like 1-3 stops.. Seems to be mostly Down, but extreme shifts plus tilt seems to cause some of it too..
Is this NOP?:confused:

Colorblinded
05-12-2008, 11:02 PM
I've never noticed that. Are you letting it AE as you shift it? Or do you set exposure with it zeroed and then shift it (sounds like you're doing this)? Shifting to the max (or near it) will cause some light loss.

SlvrScoobie
05-12-2008, 11:06 PM
this is one of my problems with the 40D, there isnt a easy way to keep the meter "running" with the shutter button halfway down.. doesnt work well with the Zoom/focus/zoom/compose method :( I guess I might need to investigate using the AF stop button, and using AI servo mode more..
(20D and rebel offer a different mode which lets you AF lock, but no AE lock..)

Colorblinded
05-12-2008, 11:11 PM
? I'm not sure that answers my question. What exactly are you doing?

uncle_git
05-12-2008, 11:31 PM
this is one of my problems with the 40D, there isnt a easy way to keep the meter "running" with the shutter button halfway down.. doesnt work well with the Zoom/focus/zoom/compose method :( I guess I might need to investigate using the AF stop button, and using AI servo mode more..
(20D and rebel offer a different mode which lets you AF lock, but no AE lock..)

If it's like most other canons look into CF4 - it moves the focus to the "*" button and the AE Lock triggers on the half press of the shutter release.

I actually prefer it set up that way as you can leave the camera in AI autofocus and if you suddenly want a one shot focus - just focus using * then release it and recompose.

Seems to be the most flexible way to have the camera set up for the type of shooting I do.

[Edit - Just checked the 5D and it's CF4 set to mode 1 - it was the same on my 1V film rig.]

iunno
05-12-2008, 11:58 PM
wow dude, awesome!

ride5000
05-13-2008, 06:09 AM
If it's like most other canons look into CF4 - it moves the focus to the "*" button and the AE Lock triggers on the half press of the shutter release.

I actually prefer it set up that way as you can leave the camera in AI autofocus and if you suddenly want a one shot focus - just focus using * then release it and recompose.

Seems to be the most flexible way to have the camera set up for the type of shooting I do.

[Edit - Just checked the 5D and it's CF4 set to mode 1 - it was the same on my 1V film rig.]

^^^ that is exactly the way i've set mine up too: * for AF.

if you shoot in manual mode there's no such thing as AEL anyway, so you don't lose anything.

SlvrScoobie
05-13-2008, 07:45 AM
nope, they changed that option, i like the shutter to control AF and Metering, but i hate that it AE locks once AF is achived :P
I use the zoom focus method, so I get best focus but when i focus its basiclly turning it into a spot meter.
It AE locks on the smaller FOV when i focused, but then i zoom out and it doesnt change the exposure.
I Guess thats how the 20D has done it for years, and i never noticed till i was in Yosemite, shooting mountains. It would AF on the mountain, but with all the snow on them, i would get super low exposures when I then zoomed out and recomposed :(
Figured it out then, never been satisfied since. I think thats why I had exp. problems with the 20D somewhat.

On the 20D though, you can set it to AF/No AE lock. the 40d doesnt offer that.. theres a guide online about all the settings ... now i cant find it, i think its at work in my bookmarks..

ride5000
05-13-2008, 09:01 AM
the default mode of the 20d does afl on half press, then exp. meter on full press just as the shutter fires. the * button does ael.

as far as the CF 4, this may be what you have in mind:

Canon EOS 20D and other similar cameras - Behavior of Custom Function 4 (http://doug.kerr.home.att.net/pumpkin/20D_CF04_chart.pdf)

interestingly in the document it does not indicate it's applicable to the 40d.

SlvrScoobie
05-13-2008, 09:04 AM
Thats teh chart i was looking for!
Why does it AEL if it updates it as the shot is taken, thats odd...
its like, 1/500 on the snowy peaks, you think oh good, plenty for handheld. Zoom out..
cluuu...nk..
What? 1/25? wtf?

subimatt
05-13-2008, 09:12 AM
grats!

Colorblinded
05-13-2008, 09:18 AM
Thats teh chart i was looking for!
Why does it AEL if it updates it as the shot is taken, thats odd...
its like, 1/500 on the snowy peaks, you think oh good, plenty for handheld. Zoom out..
cluuu...nk..
What? 1/25? wtf?Well if you base exposure off white snowy peaks, of course your camera is going to dial back the exposure because they're so bright. You'll need a roughly 2-3 stop exposure compensation to get white peaks that way.

jacobsen1
05-13-2008, 10:13 AM
OK, first, congrats. I've been waiting to use mine, still haven't yet. :unamused:

Second, YES it is normal for the meter to go a bit crazy when you shift. It doesn't do it 100% and it doesn't seem to be consistent, but it does happen. The best thing to do is to use whatever exposure mode you like, take a test shot and see how it looks w/o any shift. Then once you have the exposure you like, shift the mode to M and dial in those settings. Then you'll get a good exposure. Also, if you plan on doing shift stitching (what I do with mine) make sure all the frames have the same exposure AND same WB so they match. Yes shooting in RAW makes it fixable later, but it's much easier if you have the same WB going in anyway...

Third, get your AF to the back AF button ASAP and learn to love it. Yes it's an adjustment period for a week or so, but once you learn it, you'll NEVER want to go back. Also, depending on which mode you choose, either a half press of the shutter (and hold it) or the * on the back should lock in your exposure provided you hold it after you meter while shifting. But using M is MUCH easier anyway. These lenses are slow and mechanical to work with, so you should be on a tripod and have plenty of time anyway to work with M.

Good Luck and have fun!

subimatt
05-13-2008, 10:16 AM
Third, get your AF to the back AF button ASAP and learn to love it. Yes it's an adjustment period for a week or so, but once you learn it, you'll NEVER want to go back. Also, depending on which mode you choose, either a half press of the shutter (and hold it) or the * on the back should lock in your exposure provided you hold it after you meter while shifting. But using M is MUCH easier anyway. These lenses are slow and mechanical to work with, so you should be on a tripod and have plenty of time anyway to work with M.

Good Luck and have fun!

+1 I wouldnt dream of switching back.

ride5000
05-13-2008, 10:42 AM
Third, get your AF to the back AF button ASAP and learn to love it. Yes it's an adjustment period for a week or so, but once you learn it, you'll NEVER want to go back.

for me, the other big advantage to the * button AF is that i can leave the AF in servo mode. if i want to focus/recompose i just take my finger off it.

also, in tough lighting/AF conditions i can eliminate focus hunting from preventing a shutter release.

it's basically like having an easily accessed AF/MF switch.

during the adjustment period i had a few OOF shots because i forgot, but what the hell--it's digital! :lol:

jacobsen1
05-13-2008, 10:45 AM
also, in tough lighting/AF conditions i can eliminate focus hunting from preventing a shutter release.

that's actually the biggest reason I use it. That and also when shooting a sequence, I can use the back button to AF for the first shot, then let go and keep shooting with the shutter w/o a risk of the camera refocusing... Obviously this only works if the subject remains the same distance, but for my sequences that's how I always tried to set them up.

But I use one shot AF more than servo.

SlvrScoobie
05-13-2008, 02:25 PM
Ok - Did more testing with the lens, - heres what I posted on FM:
Just got my first TSE and upon using it, I've noticed that with the 40D, I get some REALLY erradic exposure values, when shifting. Heres an example -
Set the lens to 0 shift, meter. ISO 800, AV @ 3.5, indoors..
I get 1/250th with zero shift.
If I shift the lens Down, the metered reading shoots up to 1/2500th, but if I shift up, it drops to 1/25th..http://www.fredmiranda.com/forum/emoticons/confused.gif http://www.fredmiranda.com/forum/emoticons/confused.gif
Now I understand I will loose some light, but there is a major over exposure - like 1-2 stops - when it meters @ 1/25 - Obviously, the 1/2500 is Well underexposed.
This also seems to happen when I Tilt the lens up, and down. Up I get a higher value, and down I get a lower value. 40th when down, 250th @ 0, 640th up.
At first I thought it had to do with my screen, as up till last night, I had forgotten that I Swapped my screen from EF-s back to the EF-A, but today, its set correctly and still doing it..
I also thought that maybe since shifting it caused some vignetteing, it might cause the AE sensor to get a bad reading, that wouldnt explain the HIGHER values..

jacobsen1
05-13-2008, 04:03 PM
I'm telling you TS-Es are KNOWN to do this...
Nothing is wrong, just use M to set the exposure to whatever it reads with 0 shift and 0 tilt...

BobbyT
05-13-2008, 04:21 PM
+1 I wouldnt dream of switching back.
Make that +2

SlvrScoobie
05-13-2008, 04:33 PM
I'm telling you TS-Es are KNOWN to do this...
Nothing is wrong, just use M to set the exposure to whatever it reads with 0 shift and 0 tilt...
Weird, I wish I knew that before I bought one. I figured it would be TTL with the canon, since it worked pretty close with the russian one.. Figured the canon would be BETTER! :huh:

jacobsen1
05-13-2008, 04:44 PM
mine don't do it often, so it is odd it's all the time for you, but yeah, I'm not shocked you're saying it's happening is what I'm saying... I'll see if I can remember to try it out on my 40D tonight and report back. I've had it happen once or twice with the 5D though. Not enough to worry about it, but I always meter with no shifts/tilts, switch to M then shoot.

SlvrScoobie
05-13-2008, 04:48 PM
its not even that its just off a little, its that as I shift, i can see the exposure change linearlly with distance..
its like its being told to do it, like when you zoom and the F number changes..there is no change in brightness in the viewfinder when I shift a little, but I see the meter drop from 250-125-60-30 like each 1/2 MM i shift it..
and in the opposite direction its 250-500-1000-2000...
doesn't even make sense for it to do that!!

jacobsen1
05-13-2008, 05:03 PM
yes, but that's exactly what I've heard described before. I've never watched as I shifted though.

SlvrScoobie
05-13-2008, 05:51 PM
Grumble.
Wtf does it do that?? thats so stupid
must be something about how the AE meter works?

ride5000
05-13-2008, 06:08 PM
the 40d has a particularly fussy light meter, from what i've read.

for example, look at the max/min aperture specs on the katz eye focusing screens for the 20 or 30d and compare them to the 40d.

SlvrScoobie
05-13-2008, 10:44 PM
i did notice the 20D and the rebel arnt as sensitive - but thats just a quick test..
I think ill just use AEL and then add a stop
Or, use Live view, which works perfectly! =D